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 Premium Service [COMPLETED]
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Damn. I personally would still pay for premium, as I haven't noticed much downtime, especially compared to some other forum hosting services.

Not another year of course, no.

You might not have noticed downtime perhaps due to your time zone, but it has been there and there's no denying it. While it's still not horrendous downtime (1+ days worth of downtime), and we work tirelessly to keep it working and inform everyone of what's going on, I don't feel like this is acceptable even for free users. Especially not when we were pretty much clean before all of this began. So attempting to sell a premium product is just off the table right now.

We would rather put this aside for now and focus on other features in our bin that have yet to be completed, as well as continue to deal with attacks and defense solutions until the most stable option has been found.

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email: admin@jcink.com :: blog: John C.
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This decision makes a lot of sense. The service must recover from these DDoS attacks and the negative effects from the filtering service first, including getting some of the users back, who left a while ago because of all of these problems.

I would recommend adding more servers to the service, even if they're small ones. It could help in the stabilizing of the service until all issues with the host aren't resolved.

For me, JFH is always going to be my forum host of choice. Forumotion, for example, is just too complicated to use for me, the ACP is different and so on. There are a couple of great forum hosters out there, but JFH is the best for me, so far. So you don't have to worry about me leaving... biggrin.gif

In other terms, ITE and SHU remain on Jcink, period. biggrin.gif

This post has been edited by mnikolic: Feb 23 2013, 04:34 AM
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Adding more machines won't really solve anything for us, unfortunately.

I've been asked why we don't just buy a ton of servers and use them for defense, but it just doesn't work that way. We could have 100 servers with a huge array and would still face the same problem.

The issue is not related to not having enough memory/disk space/what have you, but rather network hardware, and bandwidth related.

Think of it like a sponge. The bigger the sponge, the more you can absorb and filter out at one time, right? Our network sponge is pretty... small in comparison to the sponges that DDoS filtering companies have in place. Their sponge has all sorts of extra filtration fibers since it was custom made and with a huge one, you can do things like that. Everything goes through their sponge first, then gets passed to ours all nice and pre-filtered. Giant flows don't kill the big sponge because it's large enough to hold all the crap while still passing the good to us. That is the layman's explanation of the process, but it's close to how it all actually works.

So, we have to sit behind a network that was built and prepared to be attacked with really strong stuff - not cheap by a longshot to build and develop such technology either. Protection has to be contracted out to third parties, who are not always the best in the world, and I think they themselves are feeling the strain right now of having a lot more customers to protect as attacks get worse and increase.

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email: admin@jcink.com :: blog: John C.
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I made an account here specifically to post in this thread. Forgive me if it gets slightly tangential toward the middle.

I would really love to have a Premium option available to me for my boards, but the fact that you have decided to delay this until you are able to get your free service under control is incredibly admirable. There are so many hosting companies and software companies that are so determined to make money that they tend to just throw "final projects" out there while in the meantime taking a long time fixing (or never fixing) the base problems with what they are offering.

Jcink has not even an appreciable fraction of the problems these unnamed companies have had (the only downtimes I've experienced have been short and manageable), and yet you remain firm in offering the very best service you can offer even to your free users before moving on to the next project. I commend your determination and am overwhelmed with admiration for your good business sense. Never have I been more glad that I switched to your hosting service than I am right now.

Thank you for your incredible service. I eagerly look forward to the Premium Service you will be providing in the future.

This post has been edited by stonefish: Feb 24 2013, 07:10 PM
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stonefish, I really appreciate hearing things like that. Glad to have you with us while we get past all of this.

We hope others will take the same attitude towards us and really see that we're trying so hard, and at the end of the day we're also really a victim in all of this. We don't like seeing our service go down because of filtering company failures or because of DDoS attacks. Some have emailed me questioning if we're going out of business because of all of it, and I was horrified to hear that.

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email: admin@jcink.com :: blog: John C.
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QUOTE (Jcink @ Feb 23 2013, 03:36 AM)

Not another year of course, no.

You might not have noticed downtime perhaps due to your time zone, but it has been there and there's no denying it. While it's still not horrendous downtime (1+ days worth of downtime), and we work tirelessly to keep it working and inform everyone of what's going on, I don't feel like this is acceptable even for free users. Especially not when we were pretty much clean before all of this began. So attempting to sell a premium product is just off the table right now.

We would rather put this aside for now and focus on other features in our bin that have yet to be completed, as well as continue to deal with attacks and defense solutions until the most stable option has been found.


Thanks Jcink I think this is a great decision.
Thank you for being concerned with the free customers service as well.

I have to tell you hands down the best feature at Jcink is.....
Jcink himself. wink.gif
I've had a lot of message boards and I don't think I've ever had one where the owner was as much involved or cared as much about the service that they provide. You are appreciated. Thanks Again.


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Have a quick question.

So, if you buy the premium service then you will be able to get a monthly (or possibly tri-monthly) plan to use a flat rate of getting rid of ads completely?

Assuming that's correct, would it at all be possible to do this without having Premium (or is that sort of the whole point of it being here >_> )?

Just wondering because that is really something I'm interested in. I tried the 'buy ad credits' and I made them invisible for everyone and I lost 5 dollars in less than one day because of page views.

Considering I can't afford $2,000 a year for ad removal I would really hope this feature will be available for everyone, even if not initially.

--

Also, will comment and say like most other users it's awesome to see Jcink worry about making services better on a fundamental level before worrying about getting out a premium product. smile.gif
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So, if you buy the premium service then you will be able to get a monthly (or possibly tri-monthly) plan to use a flat rate of getting rid of ads completely?


Yes. Premium is monthly subscription based.

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Assuming that's correct, would it at all be possible to do this without having Premium (or is that sort of the whole point of it being here >_> )?


Well, it's a partial reason why premium is being implemented. But, no, sorry it's not possible to have a month to month plan for ad removal until this is finished.

As a premium user, your board will have advertising removed, and added feature options. Also, a less restrictive terms of service in regard to mature content.

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Also, will comment and say like most other users it's awesome to see Jcink worry about making services better on a fundamental level before worrying about getting out a premium product


Thanks for that. Although I realize a lot of people want this, I don't want to rush it out the door while we've been having problems. The good news though is that in the last week our uptime has been fantastic since the switch to the protection company, so we really might be back on track to how things used to be. As a result, paid and free services have DDoS attack protection now.

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email: admin@jcink.com :: blog: John C.
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Just want to say that I have been very happy with the improvement in up-time on my board in the last week. Whatever was changed, it seems to have really helped. Additionally, I would be very happy to see a premium service added, as I too would like permanent ad-removal for a reasonable price. I am worried about running into the exact problem Cal mentioned.

Please keep us updated! I can't wait for this feature to be added. :)
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Hey, we're really happy to hear that.

We posted a big announcement in everyone's Admin CP about a change over to an entirely different provider and they have really been doing well for us. So we're in really good shape right now. I'm still very paranoid about problems occurring so we're keeping a close eye on the service for the moment, but as each day goes by we'll be able to get back on track to working on this again.

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email: admin@jcink.com :: blog: John C.
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I think this is great and I hope this happens soon.

But I was wondering, and excuse me if I'm asking something that has already been thought of but aren't there going to be legal problems from this? Like what if a user just left an 18+ forum open and a minor wandered onto it?
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Not really because minors are warned off of the mature content by the fact that you have to be thirteen (13) to even sign up for this service. (And by thirteen (13) most schools have had health classes explaining the birds and bees and have discussed world wars, both mature subjects with students.)

If someones minor child then got onto a forum and wandered into mature content then it is on the parents for not setting up parental controls or blocking it. It is not the legal obligation of Jcink to regulate or monitor forums and to prune users below age limits set by the Administrators. The only obligation Jcink has is to remove minor children under the age of thirteen (13) that register to his service.

If an administrator of a forum is paying for Premium though and allows members between the ages of say thirteen (13) and seventeen (17), ((because by seventeen (17) pretty much everyone knows what porn is or has seen it unless they are living under a rock or their parents have them locked in their basement)), then that is the Administrators choice and right, and is in no way a liability to Jcink.

The only legal issue to mature content on this service the AdSense terms of service that state that AdSense ads may not be run in coalition or beside any sexually explicit, extremely violent, pornographic, etc. content. And since Jcink is bound by those terms thus his must reflect those, however with Premium the ads will be removed, so the forums with no ads are not bound by those terms any longer and all legal liability is therein no longer a liability.

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YouTube | Email: crystal@jcink.com | Blog: Seriously Lacqueing
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The United States has some pretty tight laws regarding mature content and I am familiar with them.

2251 and 2257 are pretty big well-known ones if you want to look them up.

That being said we're a service provider, and this is the internet, not public airwaves. We are not obligated to police content posted on any forum. The scenario you just described could be happening right now, premium mode or not. And it happens every single day across all types of medium online even when the terms forbid it.

If a child somehow wandered onto one of those forums and then the parents got pissed off and wanted to sue us over it, they would lose in court, no matter what type of barrier (or none) that was set up to get to it. Because once again, we're an online service provider. It's up to the forum owner to keep everything legal; and even then they actually have some protection themselves for what their own users post since they're technically providing a "service" of sorts of their own. (Theory: if a user posted porn and a minor saw it before you could delete it, of course you're not responsible, right?)

We're going to provide tools to admins who want to designate forums or their entire site as needing the age to be 18+ to view. For example, you'll be able to set an option per-forum if it contains NSFW/Mature content and a simple question will be asked "Are you over 18?" or it'll prompt the user to enter their birthday, and then grant them access to all boards tagged as 18+. If the whole site is mature themed, a similar message can be displayed before even showing anything except the registration/login form.

We're not even obligated to provide such options either, even though legally they're extremely solid things to have. I'm only providing them because if I ran a forum with mature content, it's what I'd use for my own protection. And I think it's ethically right to have some kind of barrier in place as I despise when NSFW or mature content is not labeled as such anywhere on the internet. It's annoying if you're not looking for it or don't want to see it at that moment.

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email: admin@jcink.com :: blog: John C.
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QUOTE (Jcink @ May 8 2013, 09:54 AM)
And I think it's ethically right to have some kind of barrier in place as I despise when NSFW or mature content is not labeled as such anywhere on the internet. It's annoying if you're not looking for it or don't want to see it at that moment.


Would it be possible to also include a nsfw bbcode tag? I suppose one of the existing spoiler tags could just be modified.
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QUOTE (Chazz871 @ May 8 2013, 10:43 AM)
QUOTE (Jcink @ May 8 2013, 09:54 AM)
And I think it's ethically right to have some kind of barrier in place as I despise when NSFW or mature content is not labeled as such anywhere on the internet. It's annoying if you're not looking for it or don't want to see it at that moment.


Would it be possible to also include a nsfw bbcode tag? I suppose one of the existing spoiler tags could just be modified.


You could easily modify a spoiler to jut say NSFW or Mature and set it up as a custom BBCode.

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